BUSHINGS…
From: ejectr@javanet.com (Bob Runge)
Hi Jim:
Are the bushings in the landing gear tourque knee scissors bronze or steel? Mine are sloppy and I want to get some replacement material before I tear them open. I’m assuming the ID is 1/4″ seeing they use a 1/4″ screw. I plan on replacing the bolts, also. Can I go to stainless or should I stick with Cad plated?
Bob,
There is a bolt and bushing kit available from Swift Parts. Its not real cheap, but much better than making your own bushings, and scrounging up the right bolts. Every Swift owner should have one of these on hand, and replace the bushings and bolts as required. The gear should not be too tight. Many times inexperienced mechanics have replaced every bolt and bushing in the gear, and then found it was just the same as before. A hint – most 1/4″ AN bolts measure several thousandths under .250, like .246 A close tolerance bolt measures exactly .250 A NAS bolt will measure several thousandths more than an AN bolt, usually .248, and is cheaper and easier to obtain than a close tolerance bolt. Before changing a bolt, remove it and check it with a micrometer. If its obviously worn, or measures less than .246 replace it. Sometimes, just snugging it up or adding a washer will produce results. I have some stainless NAS bolts that are just the right size for several locations in the Swift gear, so I use them when necessary. I also keep a bolt and bushing kit around, if the bushings are changed, sometimes it is necessary to try several bolts to get one that fits just right. If the 1/4″ holes in the aluminum lower fork are worn they can be bushed. A local machine shop will have to do this, there are are not bushings for that location in the kit. Ditto for the steel lugs in the outer cylinder. — Jim
LANDING GEAR TORQUE LINKS…
From: Eddie Shields (WVSWIFT@aol.com)
Subject: Re: gear torque links
Jim,
I am rebushing my gear torque links scissors). I have the aluminum kind and I’m replacing them with the steel type. Does the top link go on the forward side where the botton link joins it?? I can’t tell by pictures because everyone I look at are different. The steel ones are slightly curved on one side, which way do they fit the gear? I have the adel gear with steel type scissors. Service bulletin 34 says some swift owners have installed torque knees p/n 64a40 on adel gear. If that was done a p/n 64A31 stop must be installed. Its the predrilled and tapped one. I dont have that one installed. Do you know where I can get two of them?? Thanks — Eddie N2403B
Eddie,
Why? The steel scissors is much heavier. Sure its just a few ounces, but you know, a few ounces here, a few ounces there……. If you insist, I believe Joe has those stops at Swift Parts. I have to figure out the assembly procedure every time, its not something I can remember! I believe the left and right are different. The steel scissors usually needs a little grinding to permit full travel, otherwise the links bind up before the strut bottoms. Stops for the steel links can be fabricated by using a 3/8″ OD, .150 ID Spacer a little less than an inch long, tap the ID to a 10/32 thread and grind to fit. — Jim
HOW TO MAKE AN ADEL GEAR FORK FIT AN ELI…
Jim Montague (monty747@aol.com) writes:
I have taken Adel forks, welded up the keeper bolt hole, (3/8”, I think) and had my machine shop owner friend bore them out for the ELI strut dia. (-.001-.002) The air valve can be located as original with more machining, or re-located near the top of the strut, (like it should have been in the first place) I don’t have any ELI parts, or know of any, but I have some Adel forks.
TIRES AND TOE-IN… (3699)
From: Sam Klippert (sam@olypen.com)
Subject: Tires
Howdy, Howdy; I have a few questions and your “THE ANSWER MAN”. So, I am smart enough to ask for help before I totally disassemble the plane. I have the smaller tires 15X600X6. I’ve always had 30 psi in them, and I noticed a lot of wear on the right inside tire. I talked to Bill Shepherd (he has the small tires also) and he said to keep 50 psi. The wear doesn’t look like a place that the tire even touches the ground, but it wasn’t like that in Jan. 40 hrs. ago. (could have been the low psi )??? Anyway how do I check the toe in or out. and what should it be. I was thinking to just match the left side.– Sam
Sam:
Those tires need 50 psi. That’s one reason I don’t like ’em! Unless you make perfect landings every time, it’s CRASH! The smaller volume, plus the higher pressure makes for a very hard tire. Yep, sure could have (been low psi causing the wear). Get a piece of pipe at the hardware store about 10 ft long, that will fit inside the axles. If one gear is off it will be evident. They tell me the Swifts were “neutral” – aimed straight ahead, and the Buckaroos were toed out. I don’t know but it sounds reasonable to me. Small adjustments can be made with washers at the scissors. If its way off, due to a gear box being misaligned, the gear box (“bulkhead” in the parts book) will need to be repositioned and some re-riveting done. This is best done reskinning the skin over the wheelwell. Good luck and if I can amplify this write back! — Jim
ARE LANDING GEAR PROBLEMS A “RIGHT OF PASSAGE” FOR EVERY SWIFT OWNER? (5299)
Having landing gear problems with your Swift falls under two categories. Those that have and those that will. It has been said by many experienced Swifters that the landing gear is the most maintenance intensive part of the Swift airframe. The following sequence of postings on the Yahoo! Globe Temco Swift Club site by Canadian Swifter Yves Starreveld <ystarrev@julian.uwo.ca> illustrates one such landing gear problem and the troubleshooting involved…
*********************************
Apr 29 1999 11:14PM EDT
Went for a couple of night circuits tonight (bad things _always_ seem to happen at night). On the final one, had a slight bounce, at which point both the red and green gear indicator lights came on. Went around, and was unable to cycle the gear – I know, should have just left them down and landed-. By selecting gear down and running the flaps, got the red light to turn off. Wound (the emergency handcrank) 53 times to be sure and landed without incident. I’ll go through the wiring by light of day tomorrow.
Apr 30 1999 5:34PM EDT
Well, tracked through the landing gear wiring for a couple of hours today. Learned lots, but still no gear function. With the plane on jacks, the gear indicator shows steady green. Selecting gear up has no effect, other than a click of the landing gear solenoid. The 4 up and down microswitches all work correctly. The solenoid works fine. There is no current on the input side of the solenoid, though. I traced this wire back into the wiring box to the bus bar, and then up into the multiconnector, where I can’t follow it any longer. Is the lead going to the solenoid (not the switching lead) also switched itself? Or does it just go straight back to the breaker. Clearly I am ordering up the document package from Joe, but not until Monday. The toggle switch right behind the panel also appears to work properly.
May 1 1999 9:21AM EDT
Well, the solenoid is energizing, but the circuit it is supposed to switch has no power. The motor runs fine when I raise and lower the flaps (which is how I lowered the gear). I am wondering where the input to the solenoid comes from (not the switching lead, but the switched one).
May 2 1999 9:52AM EDT
OK, Almost there… Turns out the problem was the circuit breaker to the pump. It had broken, but not popped out. Pressing it in by hand had not reset it. Attached to the toggle switch in the gear circuit, a small ceramic tube has been soldered in to the wire. Anyone know what it is/does? Also, a question about the function of the indicator lights: The red should come on as soon as the gear moves up off the stops, and the green only when BOTH are back on the stops? On this plane, the green comes on when either gear depresses the bottom stop.
May 2 1999 8:44PM EDT
Well, turns out it was the multi-connector from the junction box on the firewall on through. The lead from the landing gear circuit breaker to the landing gear solenoid was intermittently losing contact. Turns out that the multiconnector had come loose over the years. Cleaning the contacts and seating it firmly made everything work properly. Still curious about that little ceramic cylinder wired to the landing gear toggle switch, though! Does anyone have any breaker switches they would part with? Yves
*********************************
So there you have it… Ah yes, the joys of keeping a 50+ year old airplane in shape !
CERAMIC TUBES…
Haven’t seen a response regarding the ceramic tube Yves asked about. It’s a dropping resistor and can be found (if you have a magnifying glass) in Figure 19 on Page 32 of the Parts Manual. It is not called out in the parts list, though. Its function is to reduce the voltage to the gear up light, I presume to extend bulb life, since the red light is on for a significantly longer time than the other two. It also serves to make the light less intrusive at night.
A couple people have commented on the red circuit breaker on the right side of the panel. It does NOT pop out when it breaks the circuit. Great design, huh? When pushed in to be reset, it will be obvious when it does reset, if you’ve done it before. If you don’t feel latching of the internal mechanism, it’s not reset. I would highly recommend anyone who is not overly concerned with originality to replace it with a Klixon 7271 or Potter & Brumfield W23 series, so it not only will be obvious if it trips, but it will easy to reset. With a shoulder harness on, it can be hard to get the right leverage to reset the original one. It will also give you the option of pulling it, if for some reason you have the need. Geoff Crawford <swift88k@pacbell.net>
STEVE WILSON AND JIM MONTAGUE HANDLE A BURNED-OUT BULB QUESTION… (6499)
From: Steve Roth <stevenroth@aol.com>
My bulb burned out on the “unsafe” (Red) light for the gear. I can’t read the bulb number on the old bulb. I have tried various 12 Volt bulbs but none glow enough to be able to see the light with the red lens cover on. Anyone have any suggestions about what bulb to use? Thanks, Steve N2397B
Steve…
I assume you are talking about the small original lights (red, amber, & green), the correct bulb is a GE-1813. It is a .10W; 12-16V bulb. AS&S lists them in their ’97-’98 catalog for $1.32/@, if not available from a local store. Good luck! Steve Wilson
Steve,
As Steve W. already said, the original was an 1813 bulb. There may be a dropping resistor in line to keep the bulb from burning too brightly. Someone may have changed the bulb and/or removed the resistor. Jim Montague
WD-40 AND THE STICKY MICRO SWITCHES… (7199)
Subject: Re: Gear Problems
To: Fred Lipscomb <tfredlip@compuserve.com>
Monty:
I was just reading Bob Runge’s problem with his gear. During all of my trials & tribulations with my gear for the last six weeks, something I never told you. On jacks, during the cycling of my gear, it became apparent that the micro switch was not telling the hyd pump that the gear was up. Next time it was down, I WD-40 ed it, and worked it several times. But more important, I took a flashlight and mirror and looked behind the switch and found that the two wires were touching each other. In essence I had no micro switch. One other thing, luckily when I was working the switch, I noticed that the switch extended further out. This kept me from having to adjust the Micro-Switch. Isn’t WD-40 great? Thanks: T. Fred
Fred:
Lemme see if I got this straight…. The micro switch was sticking and WD-40 fixed the problem… right? So the reason your c/b was popping was the micro switch wasn’t cutting off the electicity to the motor and after the gear was up mechanically the c/b became overloaded and popped… right? I guess I need to advise the Swifters to lube their microswitches with WD-40, something I’ve been doing at each annual. — Jim
“BUSH” PILOT… (7199)
Subject: Re: Bushing/Bolt Kit
From: Bob Runge <ejectr@javanet.com>
Wondering if you could help me out. Some time ago, I ordered a bushing/bolt kit from Swift Parts. Can’t remember if I told them I needed and Adel kit. Don’t remember if they asked. At any rate, looking at the parts book, I see my Adel strut pictured and it says it uses 3 bushings. In my kit I have 8 different sizes.
Bob,
The bolt and bushing kit is mostly for the linkage, which is the same. If you get into it, you will quickly figure out what goes where. The only difference in the S-144 and S-146 kits is the trunnion bushings, which I’m not even sure are included. The ELI trunnion bushing is F 1406-1. The Adel trunnion bushing is 16117 I think the bushings in the scissors are the same, at least the scissors are interchangable, although it is illegal to use an Adel (aluminum) scissors on an ELI. (AD 56-16-04) — Jim
(Editor’s note: I think every Swift owner should have Joe send them a landing gear bushing kit. Also known as the “Bag ‘O Bushings”. For me, clueless mechanical type that I am, the bag of bushings that arrived really had no meaning whatsoever. I just put them away in the Swift parts box. Then came annual time. As my highly trained professional Swift mechanic found the one or two bushings that needed replacement, out came the bag, and there they were. Neat… But with two Swifts we go through the bag a little more quickly. Maybe I should have Erin order her own bag. Hmmmm….)
WASHERS… (7499)
The Swift Service Bulletin of 23 October 1946 (No. 10) says to use AN940-616 as the proper washers to be used at the attachment knuckle of the landing gear retracting link and landing gear strut. As those still the recommended washers? Steve Roth & N2397B <stevenroth@aol.com>
Steve:
Yes, the idea is to have a “wide area” (a “wood washer”) to prevent parts from separating. — Jim
LANDING GEAR TORQUE-KNEE FAILURE… (8199)
From: “George N2451B” <gi@globe-swift.net>
To: “Monty747@aol. com” <Monty747@aol.com>
Subject: ELI landing gear incident
Hi Monty,
Unfortunately we had an incident with the other Swift (D-EJYB) last Sunday. On the takeoff-run the right gear torque-knee broke, causing severe vibration. We tried to stop the Swift straight ahead which was impossible. First thought was a blown tire. When we got out and examined what happened, the wheel had rotated 180 degrees and must have fluttered severely. Fortunately there was no other significant damage to the Swift. Do you know of other Swifts that had such a problem? I also noticed, that both torque-knee assemblies had a lot of play. I also think that this particular torque-knee belongs to an Adel-Gear. I have not disassembled it yet to look whether it is aluminum or steel… Regards, George N2451B
George:
This is another thing which is not new. We have identified many problems or potential problems in the Swift Association publications. This situation actually predates the Association. AD note 56-16-04 details it. I presume it was an ELI landing gear with an Adel (aluminum) torque link. The aluminum torque link is illegal on the ELI gear. Read AD 56-16-04. The steel ELI torque link has never been known to break in normal service. I have seen them twisted severely after a crash and they are malleable enough they don’t break. — Jim
REPLACEMENT WASHERS… (8199)
Does anybody know of a source for AN940-616 washers for use on the landing gear retraction link attachment to the gear struts? I can find AN960 (standard) and AN970 (large area for wood) but can find no AN940 washers. Steve Roth <stevenroth@aol.com> N2397B
Steve:
I was waiting to be sure before I answered but… I think what you need to do is use an AN970 of the appropriate OD and ream the center hole out to 3/8″ (I think!) — Jim
STEVE AND MONTY DISCUSS MAIN LANDING GEAR TRUNION BOLTS, LOCKTITE, AND HARLEYS… (8599)
From: Steve Wilson <SteveWlson@aol.com>
Subject: MLG Trunion Bolts
Was talking with Joe Ranson today. He brought up an interesting issue. Not one I had thought about or encountered before. He said that recently he had been running into Swifts and owners who had installed the MLG, only to find after a few hours of operation the trunnion bolts were no longer tight. He went on to say that once they were re-torqued, they stayed tight.Well, I just couldn’t wait to check mine! Right after work I went out and started with the right MLG. I found that both forward and aft bolts were tight. Then I moved to the left MLG and found the forward bolts were tight, but all four of the aft bolts were well below the correct torque. Joe had mentioned that some folks were finding that they could take up as much as 2 turns on the bolts. Well, the four of mine took about 3/4 turn to get them tight. I thank Joe for the advice and think maybe this should be one of those items to go in the new maintenance manual. I don’t think I will forget to check them periodically after installation until torque has settled in. — Steve W.
Steve,
Another item I do without thinking of telling everyone. I check these at every annual and never gave it much thought. I suppose the nut plates have lost much of their “self locking” after 50 years. I suppose drilled head bolts and safety wire could be installed if they persist in coming loose or “Locktite” could be put on the threads. — Jim
Jim,
Yep, I’m a big believer in “Locktite,” but never tried using it with fiber nut(plates); although I don’t think it should be a problem. According to Joe, once the bolts are re-torqued there seems little chance of their become loose again. I dunno, but the ones on mine have about 125 hrs. on them since I last checked (installed) them, and only one set of four was not tight. I will make it a point to check them occasionally, but wonder how many people have actually known about this apparent potential problem. — Steve
Steve,
The Harley guys assemble a motorcycle using Locktite on EVERYTHING. Every nut and bolt. Subsequent disassembly and reassembly does not seem to be a problem. — Jim
Jim,
I dunno if that is an endorsement or not considering the puddles of oil H/Ds leave behind. I always figured they were there so a drunken rider could follow the oil trail to find his bike, or so that when the oil quit leaking out, the rider would know to add some (or was that British bikes)?… Thanks! — Steve
TORQUE KNEE BOLT/BUSH KIT… (8599)
From: gi@globe-swift.net (George N2451B)
Hi Monty,
Christian and I are trying to figure out how the torque knee bolt/bush kit correctly goes together. Do you have a detailed description? Regards, — George
George,
Only 3 bolts from the bolt & bushing kit go in each torque knee. Compare the old ones. There are some bushings that go into the 2 links that make up the “scissors” (torque knee) Again, compare what was there. Did you find some steel assemblies? You kind of have to figure out how it will work correctly and install it accordingly. From memory, the right and left are different, when assembled, if the right side upper link is straight, the lower one will be angled. And if the left side upper is angled, the lower will be straight. Pull the Allen plug and metering valve assembly out of the outer cylinder. To do this, perhaps it’s easiest to remove the 8 1/4″ bolts and remove the entire landing gear. To pull the metering valve in place, you must cut a hole in the skin immediately above the plug. (about 1″) With the metering valve removed you can put the strut tube in place as many times as you want easily to determine how the scissors (torque knee) goes. Don’t forget the stop that goes on the upper link of the torque knee. Remember the strut will go to full extension in flight, or whenever the weight is off of it. I hope this is clear, sometimes it’s easier to do something than explain it! — Jim
TORQUE KNEE BOLT/BUSH KIT, PART TWO… (8599)
From: “George N2451B” <gi@globe-swift.net>
Subject: RE: torque knee assembly
Hi Monty,
Thanks for the answer. The big problem is that when we disassembled the old one we found that it was put together completely wrong (or totally different). So there is no chance of looking how it was and just doing it reverse… We believe that this is the reason why it failed!
We believe we located the right bushings and cut the right steel tubing that was supplied with the kit but there is still a lot of play. That might go once we tighten everything but right now I am even not quite sure what to tighten and how much. The next problem is that my Swift (N2451B) has an Adel gear. So I am a little bit reluctant to just copying what we find there. Regards — George
George,
I had assumed your old one that failed was aluminum. Is that not right? You have located some steel parts now, right? Are they new? Some of those ELI scissors require some grinding to provide clearance to avoid binding up as the strut nears the fully deflated position. I can’t remember if I ever had any brand new ones, but I remember I had one I had to rework to avoid link-to-link contact before the strut was fully bottomed out. The steel scissors (torque knees) that I have had were probably all from the factory days, and had previously been reworked.
I’m not sure what you mean by a lot of play. I would call .010 a lot of play. (sorry if you’re not used to thousandths of an inch measurements) If its even more than that, there is something not right. Where the two links of the torque knee join, there should be bushings with (I believe) a 5/16″ ID. (inside diameter) Then a small steel bushing with an outside diameter of 5/16″ and ID of 1/4″ to provide freedom of movement and shear strength to the joint. Then a 1/4″ bolt gets installed there of course. You should be able to tighten all 3 bolts in the torque knee and still have freedom of movement. You say you cut the tubing. That puzzles me. I have never found that necessary.
Maybe the contents of the bolt and bushing kit have changed over the years. I sure wish I could look directly at your problem. It’s probably something simple that an experienced person would see right off. I don’t know if this is any help, I can photograph one possibly, I’m not sure who around here has a disassembled ELI right now. I don’t, I have the Adel gear on all the Swifts I’m involved with. — Jim
WHAT IS REALLY THE INTENTION OF THE LIMITATION “DO NOT LOWER LANDING GEAR ABOVE 100 MPH”… (10199)
Subj: Landing Gear Speed
From: Bob Runge ,ejectr@javanet.com>
Hi Jim:
Swifts are placarded “Do not lower landing gear above 100MPH.” Does that also mean you can’t fly above 100 MPH with the gear out? Best regards……. Bob Runge
Bob:
No, I was told once that in certification, one gear comes out first and causes a yaw, the CAA (FAA) had (has?) a requirement that the aircraft only yaws so many degrees when one gear is down and one up. The Swift, at speeds over 100 mph exceeds those limits. Once the gear is extended, I don’t see any requirement to limit the airspeed. Many people have seen Mark Holliday do his gear down loops in the GC-1A Swift. I have never asked Mark what he uses for a entry speed, but I have tried loops in my own GC-1A and it seems to me 140 mph ias was required. — Jim
I LOVE THE SMELL OF 5606 IN THE MORNING… (112199)
From: Horst Brinker <brinker@arkansas.net>
First, The section of the hydraulic manual on servicing the tail strut states in step 3, ” Continue filling till oil flows out the filler plug hole”. Now assuming we followed steps 1 and 2, it seems to me that the strut is now completely filled with oil and very little air. I thought it a tad strange but followed the instructions only to have a shower of hydraulic fluid run down the strut for the next week until everything evened out. The strut works fine now and doesn’t leak anymore. I’ve read through the blue book looking for an errata on the hydraulic manual and didn’t find it. I’m pretty much ready to draw a line through that phrase in step 3 though. Any guidance from the wizards out there, Monty?
Second question is on the adel gear. My right strut leaks regardless of who rebuilds it. The leak is from the top part of the strut, and I’m now reasonably sure it’s leaking between the trunnion and the brass sleeve. I’m not sure whether I have the “new o ring groove” cut into the sleeve or not. I used to be able to pump the 20 pounds of air into the strut to keep the leaking down, but last time I tried it, the air came back out through the brass sleeve retaining bolt. I’m wondering if it’s safe to loosen or remove that bolt to put some kind of sealant on it to at least keep the air and the trickle of oil in the strut. If so, what’s the best sealant to use? I’m worried about things going out of alignment if I loosen the bolt and I’m also worried that the wrong goop will glue the sleeve into the trunion making future service difficult. Thanks, Horst
Horst: I must confess I hadn’t read the book on the tail strut for years. Years ago, Univair sold these struts for something like $12.00, so we never used to even bother changing “O” rings when they leaked. Note (in the hyd book) the sequence given, maybe you are confusing the filler plug and the bleeder plug. On the main gear leak, there are “O” rings on the inside, and the outside, of the brass sleeve in the strut, if the leakage is at the outer set of “O” rings the retainer bolt (set screw) may be where the air escapes. You should be able to remove this bolt and put some sealant and a soft washer on it. If the weight of the airplane is off the gear, that is if the airplane is on jacks, the set screw can be removed and the brass sleeve won’t go anyplace. The sealant should be Aviation Permatex or something that won’t react with MIL 5606. (NOT any RTV compounds) When the snap ring is removed next time, the sealant won’t hold up the removal of the brass sleeve and associated parts.– Jim
WHAT’S THAT ABOUT STEP THREE??? (12199)
From: Steve Wilson <SteveWlson@aol.com>
Horst wrote: >> I’m pretty much ready to draw a line through that phrase in step 3 though. Any guidance from the wizards out there<<
Yep. I don’t know why step 3 is in the manual. Maybe just to see if anyone is reading it! If it worked that way with no leak, I bet you would have a mighty stiff strut. With the strut extended, fill through the “filler plug” (upper plug) until fluid runs out the “bleeder screw” (lower plug). That’s it! Works great; lasts a long time! Cheers…Steve
HUH??? (12199)
From: Steve Roth <>
You know guys, I am really confused now. I have been continually told to “read the book”, so when I did my tail shock strut I did as it said — filled to the bleeder hole then replaced the bleeder plug and filled via the filler hole until full. I believed what it said to do (in step three) because I felt the shock strut was a typical “shock absorber”, using the hydraulic fluid’s ability to rush thru an orifice to provide the “shock absorbtion”. Doesn’t the Adel gear work the same way? Air has no function with “shock absorber” capability of the Adel gear, right? Am I missing something?
Steve,
Re: The tail strut. The book assumes the unit has been freshly assembled with all new parts. Then, the procedure given is fine. In service, the volume of air and the volume of hydraulic fluid must be approximately the same. — Jim
Steve,
Unfortunately a lot of manuals are not completely correct. What we are talking about here is the compressibility (or rather the non-compressibility characteristics of a liquid). If there is no air in the strut, the fluid has no “room” to transfer and will experience hydraulic lock. Fluid rushing through an orifice is only one part of the operation. A typical “shock absorber” depends on the compressibility (or displacement)of air in order to work. — Steve Wilson
LANDING GEAR QUESTION… (12199)
From: Steve Roth <>
You mention the “brass sleeve retention bolt”. I don’t recall such a “bolt”. There is a “set screw” that locks the brass sleeve in place — the brass sleeve would float inside the gear barrel without it. This set screw is installed on the opposite side of the barrel from the filler hole. Soft aluminum wahsers underneath it should seal it from leaking. At gear overhaul, it was very apparent that the set screws on my gear had been overtightened into the brass sleeve and dimpled it so the sleeve would not slide freely on the chrome strut. I leaked fluid from one of them because it could not be tightened enough to seal under the bolt head. I corrected all of that when I overhauled it with a friend. I can give you details, if you need them. I envision the only place for a landing gear strut to leak is around the chrome strut itself. O-Rings should correct that. If it leaks anywhere else, then you have another problem not associated with the brass sleeve/O-Rings. Steve Roth
Steve,
I have difficulty calling a hex head bolt a set screw – although that is what the book calls it. Yes, the aluminum washer should keep it from leaking. The key word here being “should”. The Adel strut is designed for ambient air pressure to be in the small upper chamber, but with air valves installed, 100 psi or more can be packed into that small area, which can multiply several times in a hard landing. This in turn, can’t hurt anything – except air leakage! — Jim
EARLY LANDING GEAR QUESTION… (12499)
Subject: Re: 1A’s
From: Peet King <peetking@earthlink.net>
On the light landing gear on 80518, there is a tapered pin that holds the lower fork and strut tube together. It is threaded on one end so it won’t back out. It is drilled and takes a castilated nut. Later model gear has a regular bolt for this application. Where the bolt head would be, it is slightly domed. What do you call this pin?? — Pete King
Pete;
Hmm…. I’ve had a couple of GC-1A’s with that early Globe gear and they had regular bolts. At least, a regular slotted head, domed, screw headed bolt. What you are describing sounds like a clevis pin. I suspect you could drill it oversize, install a bushing and then install a 3/8″ bolt. That type of bolt should be available from Swift Parts. — Jim
OK GANG, WRITE THESE NUMBERS DOWN AND KEEP THEM HANDY… (010400)
From: “Thomas N. Veres” <airbum@hotmail.com>
Subject: Dimensions of Swift Landing gear.
Hi, My Name is Thom Veres and I am a new member of the Swift Club on Yahoo.Com . I was told that I could E-Mail You and possibly get the information that I need so that I can transport a Swift by trailer so I can get the Darn Thing Home. What I need is the dimensions of the main gear inside Right to inside Left and the C/L measurement main wheel to main wheel. The dimensions of C/L of the main axles to the C/L of the tail wheel axle. Also the Length of the plane with the Horizontal and Vertical Feathers Removed to the Front of the Propeller Hub. And Last of All the diminution of the aircraft width from the ends of the wing attach point to wing attach point. If you can please help me find this information it would be very helpful for preparation for my 700 mile trek to get her home this coming weekend. I will be more than grateful for your help. THANK YOU MUCH, Thom Veres
(Following reply from guest “Answer Man” Don Bartholomew <spectro@nanosecond.com>
Hi Tom,
Here are the dimensions you requested. Main gear inside Right to inside Left 105.5″ The C/L measurement main wheel to main wheel. 117″ The dimensions of C/L of the main axles to the C/L of the tail wheel axle. 160″ Also the Length of the plane with the Horizontal and Vertical Feathers Removed to the Front of the Propeller Hub. 221″ And Last of All the diminution of the aircraft width from the ends of the wing attach point to wing attach point. 127″ For transporting a Swift, I: Remove the outer wing panels, and put a piece of angle iron on the center section wing attach points on one side to use as a foot. Bolt a 3′ piece of angle to the wing attach point on the other side to attach tie straps to. Turn the plane knife edge on the trailer. Put a tail stand under the aft fuselage. Tie everything down. I do it this was so I don’t have to deal with oversize permits and restrictions and I feel it is more stable than carrying it on a 45 degree angle. There are a couple of pictures of my setup on Denis’ GTS Homepage. Good Luck, Don
LANDING GEAR “WOBBLE”… (020100)
Subject: Re: N80572
From: Bill Doty <wdoty@seidata.com>
Jim,
I am installing the Cleveland wheels and brakes and notice some wobble in the “oleo” struts.. How much is allowable and how do you measure. Main wear seems to be in the top and bottom bushings. I probably have approx. 1/4″ movement at the tire tread on 6″ tires. Bill Doty
Bill,
Read AD note 51-11-04. It tells you the wear limits for the landing gear. While you are at it, read AD 46-06-01 for the adjustment of the linkage. If you don’t have those AD notes, you should, and they are printed in a little booklet available from the Swift Association. Your IA must also have these AD notes, which he can print a copy. You can read AD notes here, if you have a Pentium 2 or 3 computer… http://www.fedworld.gov/pub/faa-cai/faa-cai.htm — Jim
MORE ON THE LANDING GEAR WOBBLE AND BRAKE LINE ROUTING… (020100)
Subject: Re: Messanger:
To: Bill Doty <wdoty@seidata.com>
Jim,
Got your answer on wheel wobble, sounds like I am O.K. for now. However, the wobble I am talking about is side to side “like tow-in”. Next problem is correct routing of the brake line from wheel cylinder to connection at wing. Joe (parts) told me 36″ long on the brake line. The way it was routed 36″ is to short. So probably was wrong. Can you explain proper route? — Bill
Bill,
That (“wobble”) movement is usually due to some wear in the scissors (torque links in the parts catalogue) 1/4″ is not very much. There are 3 ea. 1/4″ bolts that may be worn, as well as the bushings. 1/4″ AN bolts mike about .246, a NAS bolt will mike about .248 and a close tolerence bolt .250. Use a slightly larger dia. bolt or replace bushings, available from Swift parts. Regarding the brake line routing… Do you have the stock gear doors for the Adel gear? It seems from memory the length of the hoses was 38″. The hose gets routed between the gear and the gear door, that’s why those “bulges” are in the Adel door. It is not easy to explain the routing, can you just look at another airplane? The hose comes off of a 1/4″ AN fitting, over the gear, down, then aft, crossing behind the gear strut, then down to the brake. — Jim
ADEL VS ELI – THERE IS A DIFFERENCE... (020100)
Subject: Re: BRAKE HOSE
To: Bill Doty <wdoty@seidata.com>
Jim,
I think I have E.L.I. gear. They are air over oil system. When the hose comes off of the fitting near the leading edge of wing: #1 which hole in the rib does it go thru? #2 Does it go over the pivot arm of the gear or between the gear and inside of rib ? It then goes down to a clamp around the main cylinder of gear and then on to the wheel cylinder. Was not attached to or near the gear door, which I think are P-51 original doors. I might have to send you a picture. They say a picture is worth a 1000 words. Bill
Bill,
I don’t know why, but I thought you had the Adel gear. The ELI is definitely air/oil. It seems to me the hose goes over the gear after coming thru the big lightening hole in the rib, then inside of the gear and down… it gets clamped twice, once to the upper bracket on the forward side of the gear and once to the lower bracket on the aft side of the gear. WAIT! Original P-51 doors! Sorry to tell you, but there ain’t no such animal! The so-called P-51 gear doors are a fairly new STC. (like in the last 20 years or so..) There ought to be installation instructions for those doors, including the hose routing in you aircraft paperwork. I guess you better send me a picture. — Jim
“ATTENTION KMART SHOPPERS…” (3200)
Subject: Re: Aircraft Grease
From: Steve Roth StevenRoth@aol.com
Steve:
What grease do you recommend for greasing various places on the Swift? The landing gear trunnions, Scott tailwheel, wheel bearings, etc. You recommend AeroShell Grease? What Number? I have been using Drydene “Blue” grease (recommended by several mechanics in this area). I can’t find it anymore. Thanks, Steve Roth
Steve…
I use “LubriMatic” Marine Corrosion Control and Trailer Wheel Bearing Grease. Their code number is 11402. The label says, “A sophisticated lubricant developed for use in severe operating conditions caused by salt water, salt air, and/or atmospheric chemicals. Outstanding mechanical stability. Unsurpassed water resistance. Superior rust and corrosion prevention.” I’ve been using it for everything “Swift” for about 20 years. The really nice kicker is that it is sold at K-Mart, Walmart, etc., and is quite inexpensive. Good luck… Steve Wilson <SteveWlson@aol.com>
DON’T TRY THIS AT HOME… (040400)
Subj: Landing Gear Hydraulics
From: Bob Runge <ejectr@javanet.com>
Hi Jim: If you move the gear lever to the up position, therefore putting the valve in the gear up position, while sitting on the ground with the master switch off and the power lead going to the hydraulic motor disconnected, will this cause the pressure in the lines to the gear to dissipate thereby possibly causing a gear collapse? Thanks. — Bob Runge
Bob,
If you put the selector “up” and if there is hydraulic pressure present, the downlocks would disengage. The gear would probably not start up, or collapse until the airplane started to taxi. I say probably, because I never tried it! — Jim
LANDING GEAR TRUNION ASSEMBLY… (060300)
From: John Foster <JOHNHENRY-ANNE@worldnet.att.net>
I am rebuilding Ser# 3660 and have both new landing gear lower tube assemblies (16084) and the sleeves (16085) but now that I have it apart I find that the steel barrel lower portion of the Trunion Assembly (16108) is very rusted and pitted. I do not think that it can be cleaned out without turning a bad situation into a disaster. I discovered that there is a lot of slack in the outboard-inboard motion when I pushed it up and locked it. I do not know if this is related in any way to the groundloop which folded that gear outboard. I am having it checked out for round along the sleeve area. I called the Parts Dept. and talked to Anthony King who advised me that they show they have two Trunion Assemblies in stock, a 16108C and a 16108E. He does not know the difference and it was suggested that I send the assemblies to Athens and they would confer with Vaughn. Also the parts in Athens were used parts and Anthony did not know anything about them. I know that I cannot be the first to have this problem so the obvious question is…What is the usual solution??? What is best solution for the longest term for the cost? Is there a “standard” rebuild or a cleanout and chrome like a cylinder? A lot of questions looking for an answer. Thank all of you for your contribution to the Swift and for any assistance you can provide. — John Henry Foster
John,
I’m not sure I understand all your descriptions, but I have never seen the steel lower portion of the trunnion that was unrepairable. (not that it could not happen!) Too bad my physical condition does not permit, I would have you ship it here and I’m sure we could come up with something. By inboard – outboard motion do you mean between the aluminum and steel sections of the tunnion assembly? That would be a no-no — those pieces are usually a very tight fit. If the lower (steel) portion is rusted and pitted that usually can be cleaned up (sandblasted) and cad plated. Unless it is exteme of course. If it’s rusted and pitted on the inside, that is not critical, because the brass sleeve is the important part. The outer cylinder just must have a good enough surface to allow the “O” ring to seal.There should be a fair amount of these parts available used. — Jim
HOW TO THAW A “FROZEN GEAR SWITCH”… (080400)
From: Rich Pizzi <cece@concentric.net>
This past Saturday Aug. 5, I departed Somerset, and retracted my gear, so I thought. The gear however remained in the down locked position. I attempted to recycle the gear handle, however, it was frozen to the up position. I then thought I could solve the problem by recyling the flaps. That brought the gear up but did not solve the frozen gear switch. The emergency crank would not work because of the location of the gear switch. I flew around for about 30 min. with my hand behind the panel attempting to feel what was freezing the handle. I eventually felt something fall in place freeing up the gear switch. The mechanic thereafter discovered that the gear switch rod had somehow slipped above the toggle switch causing it to go too far up and freezing the switch. HAS ANYONE HAD THIS PROBLEM BEFORE AND WHAT IS THE BEST WAY TO PREVENT THIS IN THE FUTURE? Rich N2328B
Rich:
I spent some time trying to visualize the panel in N2328B – of course it may have changed since I last saw it. When Swift panels are modified one of the first things that is discarded is the plastic that the factory installed near the lower edge – including around the gear and flap handles. If that plastic is not there, providing a spacer, the gear and flap rods can be pushed forward far enough to make the switch miss it’s actuating lever which is welded to the rod. This same thing could happen if there is extreme wear or the lever has gotten bent. The switch can be worn or disintegrating also, after all it’s over 50 years old now and very few of them have ever been replaced. If the plastic is there, providing a spacer, and the switch is in good shape, and if there is nil wear, the system is very reliable. If your plastic is gone, a spacer can be made. I believe it might be about 3/8″ thick with a hole the diameter of the gear and flap rods. My congratulations on doing the right thing and reaching up under the panel until you got the desired results! — Monty
MONTY WAS RIGHT ABOUT WHY THE LANDING GEAR HANDLE WAS JAMMING… (080600)
From: Rich Pizzi <cece@concentric.net>
Monty:
Sorry for the delay in responding. Your help is very much appreciated. You were right – that plastic spacer keeps the gear handle rod from slipping above the toggle switch and jamming. My mechanic has now fixed the problem. This could have been really serious since the locked up gear handle prevents the emergency extension from turning. Once again thanks for all of your help! Rich – N2328B
SOLVING A PUZZLE…(120200)
Subj: Landing Gear puzzle
From: Steve Whittenberger <jssjwhitt@email.msn.com>
Jim, Just finished my annual with the help of Ray Brown. Bird was is pretty good shape but did a little tweaking and cleaning up — preventive maintenance stuff. Landing gear (Adel) was working well but when up on jacks it indicated that the upper trunion bushings needed replacement. Job was done as well as replaced the long emergency gear extension cable. Now the problem. The gear worked well in all respects during the jacking process and timing was good — about 5-7 seconds for gear retraction. The problem arose when I flew the bird. The left gear would not come up. Adjusted the cable to a longer length and the right gear would not come up. We have redone the alignment and adjustments three times and flown it each time with the same results. Gear will not come up with air loads on it. The pump will run for about 10-12 seconds and then it will trip the circuit breaker. Gear extension (normal or emergency) can be accomplished with no problem. Next we attacked the pump to see what the output really was. We got 500psi on both ports. So we believe the pump is strong. (I have always gotten gear retraction in 5-6 seconds or so and many who have ridden with me have remarked at how fast the gear was)
Right now we are scratching our heads. We have adjusted the new extension cable a few times but that doesn’t seem to have any effect one way or the other. Hmmmm…………. Any thoughts on this? We have been through all the Swift and Hydraulic manuals and I researched all your previous writings that I have at my disposal. Anybody run into this before? Many thanks for your thoughts and ideas. Cheers, Steve Whittenberger
Steve,
The first thing I thought of was, perhaps those new trunion bearings are too tight. Does the gear swing freely? If it does, check that you have all the hydraulic plumbing connected properly and then back off the emergency extension cable and make sure the gear operates OK on jacks. Have you had a battery charger or jumper battery connected when operating the gear on jacks? Perhaps your battery or generator is weak. Did you do other work at the annual? If everything else checks out it sounds like there could be some internal leakage in an actuator or in the hydraulic power pack. — Jim
ED LLOYD ALSO HAS SOME ADVICE FOR STEVE…(120200)
Subject: Re: Landing Gear puzzle
From: “Ed A. Lloyd” <edlloydaustin@juno.com>
Steve, for what it’s worth………when I had my gear off last winter and reworked them, I noticed the trunnion tubes were egg shaped on the ends and this made the individual gear leg sloppy in the partially retracted position while on jacks. The gear was moving fore and aft greater than the limits mentioned in the manual and the AD 51-11-04. I went to Joe Ranson for parts and he suggested I rotate the trunnion tubes 90 degrees, drill a new hole for the thru bolt and see if the “play” would disappear. I did that as well as replaced all the bushings that were out of tolerance which was all of them. Especially the two trunnion or tube bushings. (Part #16117 on page 17 in my parts manual). I assembled the tube into the gear leg and rotated it by hand to feel for any tight spots and I found some. I kept working the problem until the binding was gone, hung the gear and before the side braces were attached, I made sure the gear swung freely up into the well. All this done, I completed the assembly and everything worked fine. When you say one gear stays down, are you saying or do you know, is it unlocking and trying to move at all? Has Ray observed from the ground or in the air? There are some VERY close tolerances between the actuator arm with the emer gear cable drum on it and the downlock actuator housing. I have observed more than one Swift with scrape marks on the emer cable drum on the actuator arm caused by interference with the downlock actuator. Bottom line of my theory is, maybe the air loads are causing this close tolerance to become NO CLEARANCE and the gear wont move out of the down position because it’s bound and can’t go up. Know I’m preaching to the choir but then again, maybe from a different sheet of music. Good luck………Ed
LANDING GEAR PUZZLE CONTINUES…(120200)
Subj: Re: Landing Gear puzzle
From: Steve Whittenberger <jssjwhitt@email.msn.com>
Jim, Agree with the thought of the bushings being too tight. We did then swing the gear and it came down freely with no apparent hesitation. All the hydraulic plumbing is connected and in the right place. I did back off the emergency cable but only about 3/8″– maybe that wasn’t enough. However, the tension on the cable when in the normal preflight mode is pretty loose. Don’t want it to get so loose it comes off. Expect it has about 15-20 pounds on it. Didn’t check it with a tensiometer. Battery is ok and plenty strong enough to run the gear at this time. We did replace all the bolts on the gear hinges but they seem to be ok as the gear doesn’t bind and will swing freely down. The gear hydraulic is tight at the gear and I have no leakage or seepage. Guess that leaves internal leakage in the power pack. Hmmm. Guess I can get a kit from Swift parts but as I recall from Joe Ransom it is a bit of an art in doing that job correctly. Ray may be able to do it. We’ll keep working and let you know. Many thanks for the swift and informative reply. Cheers, Steve
Steve,
Before you get into the power pack or actuators, run the gear on jacks again. Manually attempt to hold on to one of the gears, preventing it from going up. Can you stop it easily? If so, you might be able feel or hear the fluid bypassing the “O” ring on the piston in the actuator. If you measured 500 psi at the outlet ports, I would not think the leakage is in the power pack. You can manually retract the gear by pushing the downlock in with a screwdriver and then pushing the gear “up”. Do this to check free operation. Your problem sounds like it may be as simple as low hydraulic fluid quantity. Are you sure you have the correct amount of fluid in the reservoir? –Jim
LAST LANDING GEAR PUZZLE THIS ISSUE…(120200)
Subj: Re: Landing Gear puzzle
From: Steve Whittenberger <jssjwhitt@email.msn.com>
We have checked the hydralic fluid several times and even after some of the extensions/retractions. Something I did find was one of the gear doors (original) was somewhat loose and though the gear works on the ground the airloads may be pushing it around to act as a speed brake. We tightened it and aligned it perfectly ……now. So I guess I’ll have to suck it up and go fly and see if that was the problem. I am just trying to do everything I can to insure success. As long as the emergency extension works okay I should be fine. However, I have not had a problem with the normal extension. Just don’t want to leave anything to chance and screw up and land gear up. That would really ruin my day.
Steve,
Good luck and be sure the emergency extension works before you fly! — Jim
LANDING GEAR PROBLEMS? BLEED THE AIR OUT..(120300)
From: Harry Asbury <gypsyone@tds.net>
Subject: Re: December #2 GTS Internet Update
Dear Jim, I’m not up to date on the Swift’s hydraulic system, but I’ve had a lot of experience on other hydraulic systems and one that has happened to me quite often was to have some part of the system not to work under load, such as the gear retracting in the air, but works fine on the ground. I have found in most cases when I can’t find anything else wrong with the system, that there is a little air in the system and it will compress enough to stop the actuator from performing to it’s maximum limits under load. The solution was always to bleed the system simply by jacking the aircraft and actuating the gear at least twenty times. The way the actuator is mounted in the aircraft sometimes lead it to trap air and it’s awful hard to get it out. Just a thought on the gear retracting problem. — Harry
Harry,
Good point. If I were working on Steve’s aircraft I would have cycled the gear numerous times on jacks. I assume Steve and Ray also did this. When I am trying to help via email I don’t know if they for a fact did that. Air in the system will indeed cause symptoms like what they are experiencing. The Swift system will usually bleed itself out after a few cycles. — Jim
MORE FROM HARRY ON THE IMPORTANCE OF BLEEDING THE HYDRAULIC SYSTEMS…(120300)
From: Harry Asbury <gypsyone@tds.net>
Many a time I would ask the military did they bleed the system and all ways they would say yes! I have found that they would give it a half hearty try and in some cases on the larger hydraulic systems they would never get all of the air out. I know on the SH3s and HH53s this was a problem with the landing gear. I’ve even seen it in the rescue hoist systems. In that case it would cause a chattering on the up cycle with a weight on the hook. The big internal winch system wouldn’t even pull the cable in if there was the slightest air in the system. I’ve even investigated fatal crashes where the control system wasn’t bleed properly and this caused the pilot to get out of sync with the cyclic stick to the response of the aircraft to the controls. It got so bad as that he was 180 out with the response and crashed into the sea. I didn’t figure that one out until four years later when the same thing happened to another of the same type aircraft and believe it or not, the co-pilot on the fatal crash was the command pilot on the one we got back. Once on the ground, I tried the controls in a low hover and right away I could feel the spongy respond and knew it was air, due to a auxiliary servo change in the aircraft the day before. They had failed to bleed the complete system. This gave me the answer to the fatal crash. The same type of maintenance had been performed on the fatal crashed aircraft. I guess if you stay in this business, you will eventual see the same thing occur again down the line. Pardon my long winded message, but I have always loved working and solving the little mysteries of maintenance. — Harry
STEVE’S THOUGHTS ON THE LANDING GEAR PUZZLE FROM LAST UPDATE…(120300)
From: Steve Wilson <SteveWlson@aol.com>
Subject: Re: December #2 GTS Internet Update
In the last update…
<< We did replace all the bolts on the gear hinges but they seem to be ok as the gear doesn’t bind and will swing freely down. >>
My first impression is one of a gross internal leak. Jim’s suggestion of holding the gear and see if you can stop it from retracting should prove that one way or the other. I occurred to me… One time I went to pick up a Swift (N78083) from an annual (not done by Swift mechanics). It was at night and one gear did not retract (acted like you say, partial retraction, then in about 20 secs blew circuit breaker). It did extend OK though, so no big sweat. What I found was the bolts in the lower scissors had been replaced and were one size too long. My guess is there was enough “play” in the system to allow them to pass on jacks, but air loads prevented one from making it during flight. Just a thought…
LANDING GEAR SCHEMATIC ERROR…(020501)
Subj: Documentation Error
From: Steve Thompson <sthomp@swlink.net>
Jim, I’ve been chasing a gear light problem (red gear up light won’t come on…but white operates normally and goes out OK when gear is up). But this is something that I have to solve myself. It does not lend itself to an “internet solution”. However, in my pursuit of the problem, I’m pretty sure there is an error (besides the ones already documented and corrected in the Commings Hydraulic Manual)…in both the Swift Owners Manual and the Commings Manual. It relates to fig. 32 on pg. 77 of the former and the same schematic in the Hyd. Man. (no pg or fig). The error is that both of the L.H. Landing Gear Limit switches (down limit and up limit) are shown in the wrong position…the center arm should be pointed to the upper contact of each switch…to be consistent with the gear in the DOWN position. It is also intuitively indicative that this is the case since the two R.H. switches are mirror images of the two L.H. switches…yet the center arms are not mirrored. The real clincher is that it just won’t work the way it’s drawn. Maybe this is old news…if so, dump this and open another Michelob… Steve
Steve, Your gear light system has evidently been modified. The original system had a green light for “down”, a yellow light for “in transit” and a red light for “up”. The error on the original wiring diagram is well known and I’m glad you spotted it yourself. There are several gear wiring diagrams in the blue book “Maintenance and Operation Information for the Swift”, published in 1987 and available thru the Swift Association. If you don’t have this book, get it! Also, read the “Monty the Answer Man” archive in the Swift site. Some of the earlier answers are not as good as the definitive answer Ron Williamson gave on the subject of relays. The Commings Manual also has several useful wiring diagrams. I’m glad you got in contact with Joel Sampson, he is an excellent Swift pilot and instructor. I don’t know if he has kept his CFI current, but I’m sure hehasn’t forgotten how to fly a Swift! — Jim
PS – I like Heineken’s over Michelob!
SAVE THOSE RETRACT ARMS… (040201)
Subj: landing gear
From: Mark Gallicano <sharky@rctvonline.net>|
Hello Monty : I have a question about my retract linkage . the actuator – arm #16030 and the crank 11-313-2302-2 are wearing egg shaped on the link assembly end. can an oversized bushing repair the wear or are they toast . thank you, mark gallicano sharky@rctvonline.net
Mark
Don’t throw away worn retract arms! They can be bushed to be as good as new. Even bent arms can be straightened. They are very mallable and hardly ever crack. — Jim
SOMETHING EVERY SWIFT OWNER SHOULD HAVE…(040501)
From: George McClellan <WWIIPILOT@aol.com>
Are the bushings easy to find for the Adel landing gear side arm links? I have some play and intend to replace the bolts. The long connecting bushing looks OK. I hope you can tell what I am talking about. The side arms that allow the gear to retract.
George
Swift Parts has a bolt and bushing kit that every Swift owner should have. You can use whatever bushings are required whenever you need them. I buy a new kit every few years. It’s always nice to have spares on hand. — Jim
WHAT’S THAT CLICKING SOUND… (050101)
Subj: Re: Landing Gear question
From: sthomp@swlink.net (steve thompson)
Jim,
I finally got my jacks and today I did the retract test. The “up” time was 9 sec. and the “down” time was 5 sec. There were a couple of anomalies that I hope are SOP… 1. going up, both struts start up together, then the left stops about 3/4 up and holds there until the right is completely up, then it finishes. 2. going down, the first several cycles the right strut went completely down before the left started down…then after several cycles the order reversed, with the left going down first. The question is…is it normal for the sequence to change…and, does it matter? 3. when the gear is up, pump off…there is a sound like a clock ticking coming from behind the panel. (never able to hear this previously due to engine noise). This does not happen with the gear down, master on. Please tell me all this is normal so I can move on to other issues like fixing the fuel tank leak and replacing the vert. stab. (corrosion…both the previous owner and the A&P who did the annual in Dec. assured me of no corrosion. I’m going back up to Don B. when I get all the parts together). Thanks, Steve
Steve
It makes no difference which gear goes up or down first. If one gear has more drag, like a tight bushing, it will take more force to operate and go slower. And if one actuator is more efficient it may operate faster. Or if one actuator has a worn “O” ring and thus more internal leakage, it will go slower. The clicking noise behind the panel likewise is normal. The gear is up, right? And the throttle is closed, right? The gear warning system thinks you are flaring out to land with the gear up! Advance the throttle a little and the clicking will stop. — Jim
JOHN’S EXCELLENT LANDING GEAR ADVENTURE CONTINUES… (120101)
Subj: More Gear Stuff
From: John Cross <crosses@houston.rr.com>
Jim:
Does anybody replace the aluminum plumbing in the gear well with flexible lines? I want to eventually replace one and it looks hard to fabricate since it shaped like a drunken pretzel. — John Cross N2398B
John
Why don’t you want to file that corner off? That’s the way Mr Commings used to do it at Univair. Wobble on that plate is normal and it would be bad if you got it fitted up too tight. It is very easy to bend soft 1/4″ aluminum tubing for the hydraulic lines. I would not recommend you substitute any other material. — Jim
LANDING GEAR ELECTRICAL…(090202)
Subj: landing gear
From: Ed Clegg <edwclg@hotmail.com>
Hi Monty,
I have a few questions for you. A problem has come up with the gear and I think it might be the swich behind the inst.panel. While flying the other day I placed the gear lever down and nothing happened for a couple of seconds. Then the amber lite came on dim and finally the gear came down normally. So indications were.
1. gear lever down
2. nothing for a couple of seconds
3. amber lite dim with slight pump sound.(lasted a second or two)
4. aber lite bright, pump sounding normal and gear extened normally.
Ok, when flaps are selected,up or down, pump and light operate normally. (no delay and proper speed). On the grd in the hanger not on jacks yet. I removed both wires from the in side of the L.G.relay. When I pull out on the sissors releasing the micro swich I get an audible click of the sol’d and a dim red light and a bright throttle warning lite. I would have expected a bright red gear light. Also there is good continuity across the sol’d. When I connect either of the two previously disconnected wires and pull out on the sissors the motor fairly groans at first and after a couple of seconds comes on normally. I am going to pull the swich behind the panal and see if that is the cuprit. What do you think? Before checking all this stuff I was under the assumption that the flaps activated the motor through the relay. But that is wrong. How is the pump activated by the flap swich and where physically are the wires that run the motor? Also, these two wires on the in side of the relay I don’t understand. The scmatic(SP) shows one from the 30 amp bkr and logic tells me I only need one to activate the pump. Either one will power the motor.??? I am heading over the hanger now to get it on jacks. Looking foward to your wisdom. Thanks Ed Clegg 3791K
Ed
It does sound like a poor contact in the circuit for the relay — it may well be that switch behind the instrument panel. Once the relay got activated, the motor ran normally. The flaps do not operate thru that relay, not the best design perhaps but it has worked pretty well for over 50 years now. The way you describe your motor “groaning” perhaps it needs some attention, like new brushes or just cleaning the commutator. I forget, but it seems to me 91K has a modified Honda starter motor. Remove the motor and disassemble it and check the brushes. If they appear worn new brushes can be obtained from a Honda Motorcycle dealer. The wiring diagram for the flaps is on page 34 of the Swift Operating Handbook. As you see, one diagram is worth a thousand words when it comes to describing the flap operation! The relay gets its power thru the 30 amp breaker and needs that to operate. Also, see the “Monty the Answer Man” archive on the Swift site. Pay particular attention to Ron Williamsons answers. Also, maybe he will read this note and help out! — Jim
LANDING GEAR ELECTRICAL PART TWO…(090202)
Subj: Re: landing gear
From: Ed Clegg <edwclg@hotmail.com>
Hi Again Monty,
I have looked at the flap diagram but still can not figure where the flap wiring physically connects the pump. Also do not understand why there are 2 wires going to the in(hot) side of the relay. I guess I’m missing something. I will work on this tomorrow and let you know the results.
Ed
Sorry I was not more clear. Get your book out. Look on pg. 32. Wire #34 is the main power going to the relay. The other wire is #104 from the selector switch behind the instrument panel, which changes to wire #24 at a junction block in the “J” box on the firewall. Wire #24 is the small wire which goes to the small post on the relay. When you select “up” the signal gets to the relay thru wires 104 & 24. A relay, of course, is an electrically actuated switch to eliminate arcing. When it “sucks in” the power gets to the motor thru wire #34. The flaps are even simpler. Wire #35 bypasses the relay by being on the downstream terminal and power runs from there directly to the motor. — Jim
RON WILLIAMSON ADDS HIS INSIGHT ON ED’S LANDING GEAR DEAL…(090202)
Hi Ed/Monty,
Ed, the red gear light is supposed to be dim. Look closely at the book and you’ll see there is a resistor in series with the bulb to reduce the voltage. Since the red light is on just about all the time the airplane is powered (unless you just like to taxi around the ramp), the resistor keeps the bulb life long and, more importantly, doesn’t blind you during night operations. The gear warning light comes directly from the up selector switch and runs through the throttle switch without a resistor. It’s supposed to be BRIGHT to get your attention, night or day. So, don’t be concerned about the dim indication when gear is “up.” As I’ve said before, in ’40K, that indicator is labeled “unsafe” because it actually comes on any time the gear is off the down stop. Most of the time it is UP, but there’s no guarantee. But, I digress.
If the hydraulic pump runs normally with the flaps, then I’d say the brushes are ok and the pump is good. As Monty correctly pointed out, the flap circuit directly switches the motor current and doesn’t use the solenoid. That’s why the flaps and gear can have different performance. I’ve always been amazed that those microswitches can survive while switching the huge current that the pump motor draws. But, 57 years of successful operation can’t be ignored. The pump doesn’t get a lot of use, so brushes should last a long time. If the shaft seal is bad, hydraulic fluid can wick up and get inside the motor. I’ve seen them get pretty goobered up and the brushes get glazed or gummed up so they won’t make good contact. It’s worth looking at anyway, but I don’t think you’ll find much there. If the brushes are gummy, Stoddard solvent will free things up, or you can use a simple contact cleaner spray available at Radio Shack. Or, simply replace the brushes as a preventive maintenance item. Last I heard they were around $12 from Honda. A bargain.
The amber light is connected directly to the pump motor and gets the same voltage. If the amber light is dim, that means the pump isn’t getting full voltage. My analysis would be that the gear relay (contactor) points are worn or it’s not pulling in solidly to make a good connection. The original relays were light duty, matched to the 25 amp motors that originally came with the Swift. Most of them were simple open frame design with a little plastic cover and not sealed up very well at all. Corrosion on the contacts and the usual dirt and grime that collects in the engine compartment are enough to reduce the contact pressure so they have high resistance. And, with the big Honda motorcycle starter conversion, the pump motor can draw as much as 50 or 60 amps when it starts up. The little relay contacts can get pretty beat up when switching that much current. In short, I’d look at the relay. You can pop the cover off if it’s an original and hose it out with some Stoddard solvent, then look at the contacts. If it’s gummy, then that may be enough to fix the problem. (you can operate the motor by taking a clip lead jumper and shorting between the +12 v power terminal and the coil terminal. The relay has 4 posts. Posts are: +12 power from the pump circuit breaker, +12v coil current from the gear selector switch, ground for the relay coil current, and +12v switched power output to the pump motor. The coil terminals are the small #6 or #8 posts and the big ones are for the motor current. It’s easy to see which of the coil posts goes to the ground, as there’s usually a short jumper that uses one of the the mounting screws as a ground. Just jump between the passenger side big terminal and the small coil terminal and the contact should operate snappy if it’s ok. You’ll get a little sparking because of the coil inductance, but it won’t hurt anything.
The motor will simply run and the regulator valve will allow the fluid to bypass without operating anything. If the main contacts are fried, then the motor will run slowly as you observed before. If it’s an original, I don’t know of a factory replacement. Mostly the replacement that’s popular is a White Rodgers (looks like a starter solenoid in the Aircraft Spruce Catalog). I’ll have to go back and remind myself of the part number, but it’s common and the part is also available from Grainger. About $25 or so.I’d be interested to hear what you find. — Ron.
LANDING GEAR SUCCESS!!! HERE IS WHAT ED DID…(090202)
Subj: landing gear
From: Ed Clegg <edwclg@hotmail.com>
Hi Monty/Ron,
Here is what I did. I pulled the LG swich and jumped it. Still had problem. Replaced sw anyway due to slop in it. Had to be relay. Replaced that and all works well. But back to original questios. On the old relay there were 6 wires going to it,
1. control
2. grd.
3. pwr from 30 amp brkr
4. motor
5. amber lite/pwr for flap. This one I thought was only the amber lite. Therefor my confusion as to where the pwr from the flap got to the pump.
6. A hot wire to the in side of the relay. This one was hot anytime the master was on. It was an old cloth wire looking very much original.
When I e-mailed you Monty I had not been able to trace it. Well this wire is /was connected to the output side of the master swich running directly to the relay with no protection at all. This I do not under stand. If the motor circut shorted out anywhere along it’s path the results………well you know. I pulled it out and the system works fine. Of course the gear retracted a little faster with it connected due to the lack of voltage drop at the relay. At the in side of the relay I am losing about a half volt with that line disconnected. I was wondering if any other swift out there has the same setup.????What do you all think of this? Thanks for your support. Ed
Ed
It sounds like sombody had a problem with the circuit breaker popping so they but in a jumper wire. That would make the motor run without popping the c/b but of course the circuit would be completely unprotected! You may now run into a problem with the c/b popping because it may be a little weak. Its over 50 years old probably and it may open at something less than its rated 30 amps. I would suggest getting a new 30 amp c/b. The Honda motor might even require a little bigger c/b, at start up it may draw 40 amps or more. If the system pressure is set at 425 psi the amperage draw of the motor should not exceed 30 amps no matter what motor is installed for continuous running but the start up draw might be higher. — Jim
TO TOE OUT OR NOT TO TOE OUT…(090402)
Subj: Wheel Alignment
From: Bud England <dalswift1@aol.com>
I was looking for the procedure to check/fix wheel (gear) alignment. Can’t find it but know I’ve seen it. Where? Bud
Bud
I have not seen that in print. I think the Swift wheels were supposed to aim straight ahead. An easy way to check that is to get a pipe that will fit inside the axles. Charlie Hoover, who has played around with alignment tells me that if the wheels are toed in slightly, a Swift handles squirrely, and if they are toed out slightly, it is an easier handling airplane. This can be adjusted with washers at the scissors. I welcome further comment. I have not done much to ever change the alignment, but I had one Swift where one wheel was toed out considerably due to gearbox misalignment. It handled Ok as far as I was concerned and I just never worried about it.
— Jim
PS… I talked with Mark Holliday & Charlie Hoover this morning, the general consensus seems to be that the wheels should be aligned straight ahead. Mark told of a Pitts that had one axle toed out and it was impossible to keep it straight on landing. I was told at one time that the Buckaroo had the wheels toed out slightly and this made it more docile than a Swift. Maybe you could write Charlie and ask if that’s true.
T’IS LANDING GEAR CIRCUIT SEASON…(OCT 02)
Subj: Gear Woes
From: Richard Aaron <richard.aaron@us.army.mil>
Dear Jim,
I see from the last Newsletter that it’s landing gear circuit season. After a long hot summer during which I didn’t do much flying for various reasons, I was anxiously looking forward to the fall to make up for lost time. Alas, I’ve been smitten by the landing gear devil. My problem is with the micro-switch/indicator light circuit; the 5 amp breaker pops every 2nd or 3rd cycle going up or down. I’ve read all the manuals, archives, past newsletters, etc. and have eliminated mechanical causes, changed the solenoid, gear switch and have substituted another circuit breaker without solving the problem. On one or two occasions, there was no reaction at all when selecting gear down, but the circuit breaker was not popped and there was no red (or amber) light. Cycling the flaps did lock the gear down though. It would seem that the problem is either a micro-switch or wiring (what else is left?). ID-ing many of the wires is difficult. Any tricks or shortcuts for finding the fault or is brain surgery by e-mail impossible? Frustrated, Dick
Dick
Before I start, on the schematic in the “Operators Handbook and Maintenance Manual” there are the following discrepancies…… On the LG position selector switch on the instrument panel – up should be down and down should be up. Wire #19 and #63 are really the same. It goes to the center of the down limit switch Wire #38 is really #28 I think Bud England asked me about that in the Chat, but I couldn’t answer off hand. I think the thing to do next is to go to the “J” box on the firewall and separate the connections and clean them with contact cleaner. (the Cannon plug comes off under the panel) Clean all the connections to the gear relay. If I follow you, the flap circuit works Ok, but the gear circuit is where the problem lies. It sounds like you have an intermittently open circuit. — Jim
T’IS LANDING GEAR CIRCUIT SEASON PART DEUX…(OCT 02)
Subj: RE: Gear Woes
From: Richard Aaron <richard.aaron@us.army.mil>
Jim,
Thanks for your reply. Yes, it’s the gear circuit, the flaps are working fine. I’ll try cleaning the connections as you suggested and also the ones on the terminal block on the forward lower bulkhead and micro-switch connections; they deserve it after 54 years. Could this account for the 5 amp circuit breaker popping though? I haven’t found any visible evidence of a short or heard any arcing and the micro-switches all work freely and “click”. Have you ever run across a case where one went bad internally? In my case the wire numbers are moot as any markers are long gone. On the positive side, crawling under the panel and out again is lot’s of fun! — Dick
That c/b popping does have me puzzled. That doesn’t fit with an open circuit. I might think you have a bad c/b, but didn’t you tell me you had changed c/b’s? Perhaps moisture in a microswich……….? Maybe some of the good minds that read Denis’ Newsletter will read this and respond. — Jim
PS Denis is at Westover having a good time, so he probably won’t get a Newsletter out until sometime next week. (Editor says… This is true!)
T’IS LANDING GEAR CIRCUIT SEASON. SWIFTERS REPLY… (OCT 02)
Dick Aaron emailed last update about his circuit breaker problems. We got some replies to share with you. First I’ll reprint Dick’s original email to refresh your memory, then the replies…
From: Jim Thomason <mountville@aol.com>
Hi, Just a thought. The original wires to the gear lights have shielding on them. This could be shorting out, every now and then, on the wire inside . One of my customers swift had new light assemblies installed in the panel. The wires were “butt spliced” with the crimp connectors. After a few years the outer shielding on the old wire (which had been pushed back to get to the inner wire) slid up to the crimp and one stran went inside the crimp and shorted. This would pop the circuit breaker whenever the vibration (rough landing) was just right. Took a while to find. Hope this helps. — Jim Thomason
From: Larry Owen <Larry.Owen@Tenethealth.com>
A few years ago I had a somewhat similar problem with the gear c/b It turned out to be the carbon brushes on the Hyd pump needed replacing. Flaps worked fine, (pump was cool, low number of amps to bring up flaps) but problems with the gear (pump had now warmed up and number of amps to pump the gear is higher) Sometimes the brushes where square-on and worked fine, other times (being worn) they were misaligned and popped the c/b. Cleaning the pump motor was no fun and finding the correct brushes was a chore but it sure fixed the problem. Larry Owen N78287 El Paso, Texas 915-577-6832
From: “Dooley, Dave” <ddooley@ball.com>
For Richard, I had the same problem with my Swift and it was discovered that the wire wound resistor for the gear indicator lights was shorting out to ground. Once I insulated that, never had a problem since. Dave Dooley N78325
From: Brian Silcox <briansilcox@harbornet.com>
Denis,
Just my two cents on the gear indicator circuit… I had this problem and discovered the microswitch was gummy, and was causing high resistance, which tripped the indicator breaker. Contact cleaner solved the problem once and for all. — Brian
DICK SAYS THANKS!!! (OCT 02)
From: Richard Aaron <richard.aaron@us.army.mil>
Subject: Landing Gear Woes
Dennis,
I’d like to take advantage of the Newletter to thank everyone who took the time to respond to my call for help with my gear circuit. Everything’s working fine now and I’ve discovered that electricity is a wonderful but mysterious thing. To summarize, I had changed the gear relay and panel switch to no avail. This past week I received new gear microswitches in the mail and changed those. While removing one of the old ones, the plunger broke off (hmmmm). I also found frayed wires going into the solderless terminal that connects to the 30 amp hydraulic motor circuit breaker. I’m planning to make and epoxy a button onto this breaker as it’s very difficult to re-set because of it’s recessed design. Mysteriously, while chasing down a suggestion about possible shorting of the outer shield on the indicator light wires I found that the one for the red light wasn’t connected to ground (but the light was working anyway). I thought that it must be touching one of the other shields in the bundle to complete the circuit but I couldn’t find anyplace that they were grounded either! In any case, while I was at it I re-wired the lights as described in the Maintenance Manual to give a separate indication for each gear individually. I found a cordless Dremel tool with a wire brush very useful for cleaning up solderless terminals and connections (go lightly). Re-wiring is on my list of things to do. I might add that I solder “solderless” terminals whenever possible. Regards, Dick N2405B
LANDING GEAR WON’T GO UP…(NOV 02)
From: Todd Warnock <tcwinmia@aol.com
Hi Jim, I am having trouble getting my gear up just after take off. I am climbing at 75 MPH and it just doesn’t want to go all the way up. The motor appears to be working fine and I have full fluid. Is there a bubble? Also, I notice that I have to add fluid after several gear and flap cycles. I don’ t see any leaks. What should I look for? Thanks, Todd
Todd
First of all, what motor do you have turning the hydraulic pump? Your hydraulic pressure is probably too low, but you can’t raise it above 425 psi with the stock or any small pump motor. You need a heavy duty pump motor first of all, then you have to be sure your pressure is at least 425 psi and preferably 450 to 500 psi. Merlyn makes the only STCed motor, but there have been many others adapted, notably a Honda motorcycle starter motor. Carl Weddle adapted a 20 hp Mercury outboard starter motor which worked well. Joe Zito also adapted several types of 12 V DC motors. To read the hydraulic pressure a “T” can be put in the gear up line near the hydraulic package. Then raise the gear on jacks and note the reading. To raise the pressure the adjusting screw on the back of the package is screwed in. There is a check nut that must be cracked loose first. Do NOT raise the pressure over 500 psi, if you do there is a chance of shearing the Woodruff keys in the gear actuators. If you can’t do this yourself, go to a knowledgeable shop or go up the Athens, TN and have the experts do it. If you are adding fluid it’s got to be leaking somewhere. Many times the lines wear thru where they come thru the micarta block at the firewall. The downlock or gear actuator might be leaking too. When the gear stops going up a little negative “G” usually puts them in the wells, but you don’t want to do that routinely. If the fluid level is low the gear won’t come up either. Do you have the so-called P-51 gear doors? You need a big gear motor and a little more pressure with them. Once you get everything set right the gear will work very reliably. — Jim
ONE HUNG LOW…(DEC 02)
Subj: A drooping Right gear
From: Pat Waters <gpwaters@aol.com
I have read over all your answers, but do not find this problem addressed. My right gear will only half retract. On jacks, I am able to move it up freely; however, it shoots oil out of the resivoir. It seemed to work and then it quit. Is there a simple solution? If you have time, I’d love to understand. Thank you, gpwaters
Pat
If your gear does not go all the way up there is probably not enough hydraulic pressure. If you force the gear up by hand or crank it down with the emergency system it is quite normal to shoot fluid out the vent. If the gear goes up and then falls out in flight it may not be rigged right and the emergency crankdown cable may be too tight. The linkage has to go over center and the uplock is actually gravity. If you raise the hydraulic pressure to above 425 psi and the motor stalls out you need to overhaul the motor or get a better one. Maybe your problem is as simple as low hydraulic fluid quantity. In South Carolina, have Jim Thomason take a look at it <Mountville@aol.com> Jim
Texas Swifter Steve Wilson adds…
Pat… I am assuming you are working with the airplane on jacks, and when you select the gear “up” the left main gear retracts completely, while the right starts to retract and stops before reaching the wheelwell… If this is true, and it worked at one time without any changes by you or someone else, then the right “up” limit switch is stuck closed. Once the left gear has fully retracted and closed the left “up” limit switch, the right “up” limit switch is telling the retract system, the right gear is also retracted (which you know it hasn’t). Sound confusing? Try a little WD-40 working the plunger in and out a few times on the right micro-switch and see if things improve… Steve W
SUCCESS!!! (DEC 02)
From: Pat Waters <gpwaters@aol.com>
Subject: Re: A drooping Right gear
You have made my day. It was stuck and is now working well. Thank you and happy Thanksgiving. — Pat
MONTY MAKES THE CONNECTION! (pun intended…) REGARDING THE RARE TEMCO FACTORY “THREE MICROSWITCHES IN THE WHEEL WELL” MOD??? (FEB 03)
By Denis Arbeau <arbeau@napanet.net>
Most of us learn, as we become familiar with the landing gear system on the Swift, that if one of the two gear down microswitches gets “gummy” and stuck closed that we can get that single green light after selecting gear down but the gear really isn’t down and locked. Some Swifts have been modified so that there is a green light for each wheel instead of just one for both, (there is more than one way to do this), and that solves the problem.
Recently Texas Swifter Ed Lloyd found that his Swift had THREE microswitches in each wheel well. Most Swifts have two. California Swift Bill Weaver is also caretaker of a three microswitch Swift. I believe there is one other out there too but I can’t remember which Swift that is. Anyway… Since Bill Weaver has a set of the original Temco FACTORY drawings for that installation we all got to wondering what the deal was. Best guess up until recently was it was something borrowed from the Temco Buckaroo. Buck owner Charlie Nelson says not so.
OK…
In fact, Charlie has reminded us that the Maintenance & Operatons Manual”, sold by the Swift Parts Dept., has a drawing and information by Nor-Cal Swifter Dick Collins which shows how to have individual green or down lights by simply adding one additional wire to the “unused” side of the micro switch already there. So as Paul Harvery says, “…and now the rest of the story!”
While emailing back and forth on the three switch deal Jim Montague deduced, and brought to Weaver’s and Lloyd’s attention, that both their airplanes had belonged to Texas A&M University. During the late 1940’s timeframe when those Swifts were under the care of the University, one of them had a landing gear failure due to that dreded “stuck microswitch” senario. The University then tasked Temco to come up with a way to eliminate that glitch in the system in what Bill Weaver says is akin to a 1948 “service bulletin”.
So there you have the mystery of the “three microswitches in each wheel well” Swifts solved. Right? Did I sum it up correctly? Maybe… If not, Monty, Bill, Ed, and/or Charlie will surely let me know and I’ll share it with the rest of you.
LANDING GEAR PUMP CYCLES… (FEB 03)
Subj: Intermittant Landing Gear Pressurization
From: Wally Boeck <wboeck@ix.netcom.com>
Monty,
Wally Boeck here. I’ve got an annoyance item – that is it is now and I don’t want it to grow. In flight with the gear up, at about four or five minute intervals my hydraulic pump cycles on for a moment. I’m reasonably certain that the right main is dropping down just enough for the up microswitch to open and cause the repressurization. I can’t confirm that with Maximus on jacks but … The challenge is doubly annoying since my last landing gear overhaul work was on the right actuator – a minor but annoying leak aroundthe back, spar side of the center shaft demanded new o-rings, felt and all. That gives me cause to wonder if I did anything poorly and that’s always possible given the blind nature of the center shaft’s reassembly. Any thoughts before I tear into the actuator again? If my challenge were to be caused by a leaking o-ring on the actuator piston, can the o-ring be changed with outa full disassembly? Maximus’ (#118 N80715) caretaker
Wally
That problem is usually associated with the flaps — either the seal in the flap cylinder is leaking internally or the brass plates in the hydraulic package are leaking internally. Having said that, it is possible that when you reassembled the gear actuator you got the gear off one tooth. This would cause a mis-rig of the gear and the possibility of the gear coming off the micro switch. Put the airplane on jacks and let it sit for a while, even pull down on the gear. If the micro switch clicks and the pump runs, you have found the problem. — Jim
Jim,
Thanks for the feedback. If I did get the gear piston reassembled one tooth off, can that be corrected just by pulling the piston cover plate and realigning the piston and tooth assembly within the gear actuator?
Wally
Well yes, and no. You can take out the 4 screws and remove that cap and then with the landing gear linkage disconnected you can get the piston out, then you can try to reindex the rack with the gear. From old memory, it seems that maybe that only works on one side. It’s probably easier just to pull the actuator. When I do the actuator on a “new” (to me) Swift I always centerpunch the rack & gear so I get them back together the way they were. — Jim
RICK SCOTT HAS ANOTHER THEORY RE: WALLY’S DROOPING GEAR DEAL… (MAR 03)
From: Rick Scott <swiftbird4@hotmail.com>
To: arbeau@napanet.net
Hi Denis,
A reply to Wally’s problem. I had the same problem quite some time ago, the root of the problem turned out to be the emergency pull down cable was slightly out of adjust. And I mean VERY slightly!!! It wouldn’t quite let the gear over center so it would droop slightly inflight and the pump would cycle. Mine just started doing it one day with no prior trouble. I rerigged the cable and have never had a problem since. Put the aircraft on jacks, retract the gear. Reach in the well and pull down on the wheels one at a time, if you hold it for a second the pump will probably cycle. If the cable is set up too tight and you have the master off you will be able to pull the gear down and it will fall part way out….. Time to readjust the cable tension. — Rick.
LANDING GEAR TROUBLE… (MAR 03)
Subj: N2435B
From: Mark Sorensons <marksorensons@aol.com>
Hi Jim,
Understand that we have near sister ships. I have been following the newsletters and information that you have been helping other with over the past 8 mo since I have acquired my swift. It sure is a blast to fly. However I have noticed something I wanted to get your opinion on. First of all 2435B is a completely stock 145 down to the old bench seats. Anyway I was on approach to land with the gear down and decided to go around and change landing direction. So I selected the gear to UP and the gear retracted very slowly. I noticed that the left gear didn’t make it all the way up in to the wheel well. I then selected gear down and nothing. Remembering the old flap up an down trick I got the green light and decided to land. Now I want to trouble shoot. I suspect that it may be the gear CB on the panel. But it didn’t trip in flight. I say this because if you trip it manually on the ground it is very difficult to re-engage. If it is the Gear CB wouldn’t that affect the Hyd. Motor for the flaps? Or is that CB in line with the Gear selector and if the CB is bad then no power goes to the selector to run the gear. If that is so, can you give me a brief explanation on how the flap actuator can provide power to the gear selector and know whether to lower or raise the gear? Thanks Jim!
Mark
Did you reset that red circuit breaker? It sure sounds to me like it popped. If the air loads are too high on the gear, such as on a go-around, that is the classic situation for when the c/b pops. Remember, those old circuit breakers are now over 50 years old and they might not function exactly the way they are supposed to. (it may open without popping all the way out) The flap circuit has no relay, only the 30A c/b switch on the panel. If the system is pressurized whatever hydraulic ports are open in the selector will receive pressure. Thus you can lower the gear by repeatedly cycling the flaps. — Jim
LANDING GEAR TROUBLE PART DEUX… (MAR 03)
Subj: N2435B
From: Mark Sorensons <marksorensons@aol.com>
Jim,
I totally forgot about the red circuit breaker! I remember have been briefed on that from Wayne when I bought the airplane. It is out of the way and recessed so I just missed that completely. You probably think I should attend Swift recurrent training after forgetting about that. Anyway, next question. Is there something available as far as a conversion for giving my swift a control for intermediate flap position? I live on a grass strip and have used the technique of lowering the flaps half way with the stock flap selector the moving the switch to the middle position to close the hyd port. But the hyd pump still runs and that has got to put a strain on the system if that technique is used over an over. I like the flaps when I am flying near gross weight but its not necessary when I am by myself. By the way, did I tell you how much fun this plane is? Best Regards, Mark Sorenson 678-GO-FLY
Mark
There is available a switch to run the flaps to an intermediate position. Call Swift Parts. Having the motor run all that time sounds like the worst idea I heard recently! I like full flaps or nothing. Just my personal preference. I’m glad you like the Swift, I sure like mine, but due to health problems I don’t enjoy it like I used to. — Jim
SLOW TO RETRACT PROBLEM SOLVED… (APRIL 03)
From: Swiftflier@aol.com
Subject: Re: April #3 GTS Internet Update
Just wanted to tell everyone that my “slow to retract” landing gear problem is solved! Jim Thomason reckoned that one of my gear actuators was by-passing, and even though there were no leaks or outside discrepancies in either gear well, the actuators were suspect to him. Well, he was correct… and after he overhauled both actuators the landing gear problem is solved.
Thanks, Bill Tiley (N131W).
GOODY GOT HIS LANDING GEAR PROBLEM FIXED… (JUNE 03)
Subj: Gear
From: Goody Goodrich <ogoodyg@netex.quik.com>
Jim: To catch you up on my gear problem and hopefully help some other people why might have similar problems. When I would retract the gear the left gear would go up and lock and then the hydraulic pump would stop before the right gear was completely up and locked. All indication was a bad mico-switch on the uplock side of the right gear. A new mico-switch did not solve the problem and finally after checking everything else, I removed the down lock mico switch. The gear had been going down and locking as neat as could be, and so I had not thought of doing anything to that mico-switch. There are four {4} wires on this mico-sw. and there was bare wire showing on three of the four connectors. I put on four new connectors and then make a new wire to run between the two mico-sw. – – there is one common wire. Everything back togather and it works like a charm….. So, as Jim told me on a message last nite – – you have a wiring problem in your right gear. How true and thanks again Jim for saving another Swift Caretaker….. Goody
Goody
Thanks for the update on your gear problem. I knew it would be something like that. I just got finished with a gear problem myself. I am restoring N2460B, the last Swift built. Previous owners had not been able to solve a gear problem and had installed a hand pump. Neither the gear or flaps would work with the electric pump. Mark Holliday flew the airplane up here from Texas a few years ago and had to pump the gear up and down by hand. Ditto the flaps. If one thing is wrong, that’s bad enough but this critter had EVERYTHING screwed up! The gear motor, a Honda starter, was burned out. I replaced the motor. Still no action. I changed a some wiring. Then I had flaps but no gear. Eventually, Mick Supina found a bad switch at the selector behind the instrument panel. Then there were more bad wires. Finally, the gear came up on its own! But the motor would not shut off. Adjusting the left up microswitch fixed that. The gear would just barely make it up, so we loosened the hydraulic package from the firewall and raised the hydraulic pressure about 1/2 a turn. Everything works now, but the stock motor may not be good enough when we get flying. We’ll cross that bridge later! — Jim
GEAR PROBLEM… (AUG 03)
From: Jim Renfrow
Subject: Gear Problem
Here is a bit more info on 270’s gear. Never a problem in five years ’til now. First indication was failure to fully retract on climbout with speed 80 or less. Pump continued to attempt to complete cycle, but at least one up limit switch not engaged. Checked fluid level, serviced to full and flew again, same result. Both gear move as normal but at least one fails to make up limit switch, gets within about one inch of being up. Extension is totally normal. Put acft on jacks. Ran several retraction cycles, checked free play, lubed trunion fittings, swung manually to check freedom of movement, checked switch actuation, checked adjustments per AD’s. All functions on jacks are normal, gear fully retracts and all indications (lights) normal, pump shuts off when last up limit switch met. While on jacks, the only abnormal event noted was a pretty good size puddle of hydraulic fluid accumulation on the hangar floor at mid-ship location. Only thing I can think of there is the flap actuator. It must have developed a seal problem and during gear retraction is porting fluid and probably pressure overboard. I’m wondering it this loss of system pressure might be sufficient to rob the gear of enough pressure so that the retraction cycle is incomplete. What are your thoughts on this, any ideas? Have not heard of this exact scenario being discussed. Regards, Jim and Kay
Reading what you have experienced two things are obvious: (1) You have a drop in system hydraulic pressure. (2) You have a hydraulic leak. Just as a guess, I would look first at the hydraulic lines where they go through the firewall. They are clamped in a phenolic block which can be removed by taking out four AN3 bolts. Inspect the lines for wear and/or pinholes. While the first belly panel is removed also check all the “B” nuts for leaks. — Jim
Texas Swifter Ed Lloyd, who was the original recipient of Jim Renfrow’s email and who forwarded it to Jim Montague, wrote…
Obviously this sheds a whole new perspective on things. I would pull the belly panel and with the airplane on jacks, have Kay or someone actuate the gear to the up position while you observe the hydraulic flap actuator and lines in that area. Could be a simple thing like a reseal of the flap actuator or a loose ‘B’ nut or a ruptured line. During the gear retraction cycle there should be no pressure in the flap hydraulic system………. unless the flaps are actuated at the same time. Sort of like the reverse of the emergency gear lowering procedure when the gear handle is down and you actuate the flaps up and down to get the gear down. The flap selector valve in the power pack would have to be “open” to get pressure going to the flaps. Cheers… Ed
Editor says… The hydraulic leak is a concern. However, if the leak ain’t that bad… About 20 years ago I had the same retract problem with my Swift. Buzz Winslow and I checked EVERYTHING just like you described on yours and it all checked out. I even remember putting in a new battery. Then, during yet another retract on the jacks Buzz put his finger on one of the tires and stopped all movement, bogging down the motor until a breaker popped. He then went to the back of his hangar, fished around in a box of “junk” for a couple of minutes, appeared with another stock gear motor, installed it on the pump, and when we tried the retract on jacks again Buzz couldn’t stop the gear even with both hands on the tire. I ended up using that motor about 15 years until it wore out. Try another gear motor… that may be the deal… Denis
STEVE WILSON. GUEST ANSWER MAN… (OCT 03)
Subject: Swift Gear
From: Richard Fox <Foxaero4@wmconnect.com>
Hi Steve ! I just bought a 1946 Swift from Rick Matson N90356. I have a question on the gear sys. As most people do. I am an IA and have studied the wire dia. several times in the air, in smooth air, the amber light has flashed on and off several times. I thought this meant the power pack was running but the amp meter didn’t seem to show a draw. Also it happened once on the ground at start up. Also once and only once after takeoff I put the gear sw. to the up position and nothing happened. I checked the CB and was ok on the second attempt it worked ok. I haven’t flown it since but I lubed and checked all four micro. sw. Am I on the right track or what can you advise. Also do you know where i can buy new up and down lock switches. Thanks Richard Fox
Richard… I am forwarding this e-mail to Denis Arbeau and maybe he will put you on the GTS E-mail List. The cycling of the yellow light is exactly as you say, the power-pack is running when the light is on. The most likely thing to cause this is the flap bleeding down a bit. It can also be caused by one of the main landing gear that is not over-center bleeding down also. The fact that the light comes on for only a second or so, might not be enough to excite the ammeter, especially if the airplane is equipped with an alternator. The gear and flap switches behind the panel can be replaced. I thought Swift Parts had some, but have not bought any recently, so not sure. They are relatively inexpensive considering the usual price of airplane stuff. I’d start there especially if the problem repeats itself. If you don’t have them already, you should purchase all the books for the Swift sold by Swift Parts. I think they have a package price for all of them. The problems you talk about are covered in the one entitled “Maintenance and Operation Information for the Swift.” It is often referred to as the “Blue Book.” Glad to hear you have a Swift and I know you will enjoy it. Don’t hesitate to ask questions. That’s how we all learn… Steve Wilson
BREAKER POPS DURING GEAR CYCLE… (OCT 03)
Subj: Gear retraction
From: Alain de Valence <alaindevalence@free.fr>
Dear Jim,
I am the caretaker of the N 80903 in France, she remained on the ground for 2 months, and when I flew her again I had the gear partialy up (about 45°), the breaker popped up after a while (45 sec to one minute) I checked the hydraulic fluid level, the battery charge and look for any leak on gear and flap actuators. Everything was right. Even on jacks I tried again and had the same problem. The pump runs well till the breaker pops up. I suspect some air in the circuit , but I don’t know how to bleed it. The hydraulic manual I have from Swift foundation shows an hydraulic pump which is not exactly the same I have on the plane. Can you help me to fix it? Thank you. Swiftly, Alain
Alain
If you have the original hydraulic pump motor it is not too unusual for it to fail to operate well. You might try to disassemble it, clean it and turn the armature commutator and replace the brushes if they are worn. Many Swifts have newer 12 volt motors of similar size adapted, such as a Honda motorcycle starter motor. Here in the US Merlyn products offers an STCed replacement. The system is self bleeding, two or three cycles of jacks should clear out any air. — Jim
LANDING GEAR HANDLE…(AUG 04)
Subj: HELP!! – AGAIN!!
From: Mick Supina <masupina@mmm.com>
Jim, the last few flights I have noticed that I had to turn the landing gear switch higher to retract and lower to extend the gears than normal. however, everything continued to work OK. Today, I just went up and – after takeoff – I turn the switch to the retract/up position and it turned farther than it has ever turned and no matter how far I turned it the hydraulic motor did not engage and the gear did not retract. I few back and put her in the hangar. I did not have my work light at the hangar so I have not put it up on jacks yet, nor looked under the IP. I will probably start digging into it tonight (Friday). Have you ever encountered anything like this? My first thought is to see if those tabs on the shaft that actually activate the micro switch are bent out of position and not making the switch. Then I guess I could manually activate the switch to see if the pump activates and the gear retracts. I’ll check the hydraulic fluid also I suppose. I guess another obvious check is if the lock pin has sheered so the control knob is rotating, but the shaft into the hydraulics is not moving. Do you have any other ideas that I should check out??/ Thanks for your insights on this!! The good news is the gear was in the down position when this happened!!
Mick
There is a little set screw that retains the gear knob. It is either loose or has slipped. It could also possibly be the pin or clevis at the front end of the rod, we will check that out. — Jim
IT’S FIXED…
Easy fix… A friend once told me to always remember ‘first principles’ – IE, look for the obvious.
The set screw had backed out of the knob. Evidently there was enough friction of the screw against the rod after it cleared to hole to turn the shaft – although with slippage – hence my notice of the control knob traveling farther to activate the gear. My second lesson is that I should have looked for a problem immediately when I noticed the additional travel in the knob. When it doesn’t feel right, it probably is not right!! Anyway, I reset the screw, checked it all out and still got a nice flight in before sundown. See you tomorrow! By the way, I found a battery box in fair shape in a corner of the hangar. I don’t know if you’ve looked at it before. I’ll drop it over to see if you can us it on the last Swift. Thanks!!! Mick Supina
